We also talk about the re-launch of our Body Image Coach Certification program, including our newest offering the Body Image Coaching Foundations course.

Don’t forget, I’m on iTunes! You can be one of my kick-ass subscribers. Also, I would be SO GRATEFUL if you took 2 minutes to leave a review. Go here -> click “Reviews and Ratings” and then “Click to Rate”.

Amapoundcake:
We can’t criticize people for wanting to lose weight individually. Because we have not created the alternative system that we dream of.

Summer:
This is eat the rules, a podcast about body image, self worth, anti dieting, and intersectional feminism. I am your host summer Innanen. a professionally trained coach specializing in body image self worth and confidence and the best selling author of body image remix. If you’re ready to break free of societal standards and stop living behind the number on your scale then you have come to the right place. Welcome to the show

this episode of eat the rules is brought to you by you on fire you on fire is the online group coaching program that I run that gives you a step by step way of building up your self worth beyond your appearance. With personalized coaching from me incredible community support and lifetime access to the program so that you can get free from body shame and live life on your own terms. Get details on what’s included and sign up for the next cycle at summer innanen.com forward slash you on fire. I’d love to have you in that group.

This is episode 288 and I’m joined by Danny Amapoundcake Adams and we are talking about some of the recent headlines in the news around anti fatness including the photos of Emily Ratajkowski in extra large jeans, and Oprah’s announcement that she’s been using weight loss drugs. We segue into talking about what to do if you still want to lose weight, or if you work with clients who want to lose weight. Finally, we talked about the relaunch of our body image coach certification program, including our newest offering the body image coaching foundations course, you can find the links mentioned at summer innanen.com forward slash 288.

I want to give a shout out to Julia lf 91 Who left this review. This is such a good podcast with wonderful resources and tips for developing healthy body image. The episode about mirror checking hit home hard for me, made me feel less alone.

Thank you so much, Julia, I’m so glad that you picked the time to leave that review. And that that particular episode helped you out. You can leave a review by going to Apple podcasts search for eat the rules. Then click ratings and reviews and click to leave a review. Don’t forget to grab the free 10 Day body confidence makeover at summer innanen.com. Forward slash freebies with 10 steps to take right now to feel better in your body. And if you’re a professional who works with people who have body image struggles, download the free body image coaching roadmap for professionals at summer innanen.com forward slash roadmap. As always, you can just find everything at the body image coach.com I have a terrible sinus cold at the time of recording this episode. But I’m actually pretty proud of myself for the way it turned out hope because I am not feeling well. But we needed to get this done. Before the holidays. This was recorded in December. And we did it. And so I’m not going to talk much more in this intro because I’m done. But enjoy this episode. It’s a great one. And if you want to hear more about the body image coach certification program, as well as the new offerings that we have, including the body image foundations course, which is a self study version of the program, go to body image coach certification.com in the show notes for this episode, I’m also going to link to a bunch of other episodes where Danny and I talked about our program including Episode 221, Episode 237, and Episode 253, I believe but that will all be linked in the show notes for this episode. Let’s get started. Hi, Danny, welcome back to the show.

Amapoundcake:
Hi, Summer, how you doing?

Summer:
I’m surviving.

Amapoundcake:
It’s winter time, things are going around.

Summer:
All right. We are here today to talk about a bunch of things. But really, I think the core of our conversation is going to be discussions around you know what to do if you you know, if you still want to lose weight, or if you’re questioning weight loss. And if you’re a provider who works with people who are maybe on the fence about accepting their body, or they’re still engaging in some dieting behaviors and how to be able to support those people too. And I think that a lot of that pressure comes in January, which is when this podcast is going to be released. And we’ve seen some anti fat stuff in the media lately. And that stuff perpetuates people’s desires to want to lose weight. First thing we want to talk about that we’ve seen in the media lately is Emily Rakowski. Putting on a large pair of jeans. And she’s standing in one leg of those jeans. Is that correct?

Amapoundcake:
That was super interesting to watch. And see, first of all, did I know who she was? And that was following to bring a major who was a plus size model. And I was like, What is she doing and I swiped in, I saw Emily. And I thought to myself, ooh, clear this. But this is what happens when you have a team full of people, I went and looked at the team that curated this, as somebody who was a content creator, I looked like they were oversized clothes, in general are lots of fabrics. That’s the style. However, you have to think about the consequence of the things that you are creating and what they may look like. And to me, it felt like they were doing what we saw with the Biggest Loser, or what we saw with any weight loss, add, you know, all it was missing was the messaging that said, I lost 100 pounds, see how I did it? And that’s what made it problematic for me. I don’t know about you.

Summer:
Yeah, to me, when I saw it, it looked like identical to like one of those Jenny Craig ads, where the person’s wearing their old pair of jeans and holding it out. And I don’t understand what message they were trying to convey other than one that was clearly anti-fat. And you’re more on the creative side of things being an influencer. And you’ve been through a lot of photoshoots. But I imagine there’s always some sort of message that people are trying to communicate with imagery. And I don’t understand the purpose or what the messaging was meant to be and whether it landed wrong, or whether they were just completely ignorant, or did it purposefully. What do you think?

Amapoundcake:
And that’s a goal against the community. But I went and looked at the Creative Directors page, I believe it was the creative director, and they have like a lot of content where the clothes are larger. So no, but then I like even that is problematic, like, we can’t find clothes. But there are clothes for people to do these things for photoshoots. That’s a big part problem for me. So I don’t think it was intentional to be fat phobic. No. But intent does not change the impact. Like it was fat phobic like the messaging landed on us as fat phobia. But I found it problematic that they didn’t make a response. There’s so secure in their whiteness in thinness. They don’t even feel like they have to make a response.

Summer:
Right. Okay. I didn’t realize that there was no response that came out of that. And then who was the influencer? That did create the photo that then where she has two pairs of jeans, like one on each leg, like so one small pair on each leg? Is that right? Is that what she did?

Amapoundcake:
Yeah, that’s Sabrina major. She is a supermodel in my eyes. I think she is she’s done so much great work. And so she was doing that as a robot. And I think that’s what got everyone’s attention. Because I missed it.

Summer:
I had seen it on TMZ admittedly, that I sometimes watch to stay up to date on what sits in current pop culture, even though it’s a terribly anti fat show. But yeah, then I saw two Bria majors. And I thought that was really, I thought her critique of it was great. And I’m so glad that somebody called that out. And then of course, we have Oprah with her, you know, presenting her her her weight loss and coming forward and saying, Yes, I have been using weight loss medications. And there’s been quite a few critiques around that. I was saying to you before we hit record that I don’t feel comfortable, or I don’t feel it’s appropriate to criticize a black woman who’s, you know, choosing to lose weight given the fact that anti blackness and anti fatness are interlocked. And Oprah is a product of that system. And we need to be critiquing that system and not necessarily be individuals who are a part of that or experiencing oppression as a result of that.

Amapoundcake:
Yeah, I think what I see on like line is like, I don’t know, it’s complicated. What I see online is like white people, because because I’ve been sent the article only by white people like about Oprah doing the ozempic. And I think like there’s an asked to speak. And I think what’s real about it is that Oprah is a billionaire, and she has power that most common folk do not have. And then also, I think Jay Z said this, like, it still doesn’t matter if you are black billionaire. You are black billionaire. And so it doesn’t exempt you from anti blackness. And I was like, do some research on Oprah because I was a young girl or maybe not even born when Oprah got her start, right. I think it was 80s 90s is when Oprah started talking about weight loss and A weight loss has been pushed on all of us with specifically black women. We know the BMI was constructed. And it wasn’t constructed to include black people and black body structures. And so of course, you’re gonna see more black people really trying to lose weight, where it’s being pushed on us that obesity, like is killing us, obesity is showing a lack of discipline. We talk about this in the history of fat phobia, and where these messages come from. And so Oprah is not going to be exempt from feeling those pressures, especially being someone who is on the media. And where I differ is that Oprah has power, she has power to not endorse certain messages because she is global media. Now, Oprah is not podcasts. She’s global media, where she says sticks to people. I mean, come on, she got the world reading. And so that’s where I feel a little bit like Oprah has more responsibility, especially since she’s not talking about the harmful impacts of weight discrimination.

Summer:
Right. And I think that something that you and I talked about, before we hit record, that you said, is that she is the corporation, as well. So she is a shareholder in Weight Watchers, which now has a stake in weight loss medications, and therefore, she is part of that system. And can you separate, you know, like the corporation from the people?

Amapoundcake:
I mean, we do it all the time with other people. I mean, to be honest with you, like we do, I can name a few people that we do that with, like, do I think this means cancel Oprah? No. I mean, I think that this allows us to have more conversation, and not that I’m making an excuse, but I will say Oprah didn’t do it, it was already happening. It’s just Oprah put a brand name on it. But it was already happening. Dye culture was created by white people, by white capitalists, so it is going to continue to thrive because of it.

Summer:
Right. It’s a interesting conversation. And, you know, she holds a lot of influence, as you said, a massive amount of influence. I grew up watching Oprah every day at 4pm after school. And I think a lot of people in my generation explicitly remember many of her weight loss pursuits. And in addition to that, the scrutiny that she’s been under for decades because of her body, and I can’t even fathom what that scrutiny would feel like having such a massive worldwide platform. Everybody knows who you are, you have no privacy. And so I can empathize that this is a real struggle for her. And her situation is a lot different than a lot of other people. Although she does hold a significant amount of financial privilege, obviously now.

Amapoundcake:
Yeah, nothing like like I said, you know, before, like, I think it’s okay to talk about what Oprah said, like saying that telling people things like, oh, you know, obesity is messing with your brain. And for 30 years, I didn’t know that my brain was impacted by obesity and telling people that they’re fat. That’s a problem. I guess my thinking is that if we’re going to call open to the table, as the body positive community or body liberation community, then what also has to be like call to the table was the fact that how anti blackness thrives in the way that we put pressure on black women and femmes by this in particular, for example, Oprah in 1992 said she didn’t want to do any more diocese, and that reminds me of what in the early 1900s was had a McDaniels was saying, as she is the actress for Gone With the Wind is saying about, hey, I’m over the dieting, like I don’t want anything to do with the diet. And I think that is telling for me that historically black women cannot escape the scrutiny that comes with being black being a woman being in a larger body or just being in a body in general. And I think that a lot of times in the body positive community, folks are ready to attack all people equally. But when it comes to like weight discrimination, both folks run from the conversation of anti blackness

Summer:
so what do you feel like you’d like to see more of in the conversation then?

Amapoundcake:
I would like for us to kind of be more honest right about like I said, black anti blackness and the ways that black women’s bodies are always under a microscope, whether we are thin whether we are big whether we got big bus whether we got big boobs, people are always either sexualizing us, making us asexual, our bodies are always a topic of conversation. And Oprah even when she was thin when she was fed, she was always under a microscope. And also think like, it is true to talk about the fact that Oprah is a billionaire. And she is endorsing diet culture, making it harder for a lot of us to be able to live and thrive. And in reality, right, like, in Oprah’s mind, I hear her saying, like, she’s trying to help people. I believe she genuinely believes that. And I don’t have access to Oprah, and a lot of people who are having these conversations don’t. So of course, we’re going to need to use social media to counter the message, but counter it with the nuances is all I’m asking.

Summer:
Yeah, thank you for that. Well, let’s use that as a segue to talking about our central conversation, which stems from both of these things that we’re seeing in culture recently in the media. And that’s helping people who are still, you know, wanting to lose weight or questioning it. Why do people want to lose weight? I mean, I think that’s the first question to ask ourselves, whether it’s like you’re an individual struggling with this, like, why do you want to lose weight? What do you think that will give you? Or if you’re a provider who works with somebody, like why do you think people want to lose weight? Why do you think people want to lose weight?

Amapoundcake:
I was gonna ask you that same question. Like, why do you think that, like people are losing weight?

Summer:
I mean, I got lots of thoughts. I think it’s like exactly what we were talking about, right? Like, it’s a privilege, it’s like proximity to privilege, whether that be beauty privilege, white privilege, thin privilege, class privilege, ah, privilege, like, it’s all of those things are what drive our desire to lose weight. And I think that on an individual level on the surface that shows up as oftentimes wanting to just be more, you know, socially acceptable, or attractive, or receive validation. And it can also show up as like wanting to gain access to things. So for some people, it’s a matter of having access to life saving surgery, or gender affirming surgery, or fertility treatments or health care. And so I think that it’s not just about aesthetics, it’s about proximity to privilege. And for some people, that’s going to show up more as wanting just more social currency. And for others, it’s, it’s really tied to the fact that there’s so much bias in health care, and that it can be unsafe to be in, you know, to be fat, if you are being denied health care. And so wanting to have that safety, wanting to have that access, it makes sense to me why somebody would want to lose weight.

Amapoundcake:
Yeah, I was gonna bring that up. Because I think about the first time I ever heard about like, obesity, I was in elementary school, and public health professionals came to my class and told us this crisis, and people are dying from this thing, call obesity, and you don’t want to be it. And this is your chart, and you need to eat in this chart. And it’s how much you need to exercise. And you need to stop, I remember them saying, You need to stop watching television while you’re eating like, there was all these different things. And every semester, there was a public health professional come into my school talking to us about it. And so that is the beginning of the indoctrination. I’m believing. So a lot of people even as they grow older, like, oh, I have sleep apnea. I was tested for sleep apnea earlier this year. And they have this new at home sleep apnea test. But based on my size, it was like, oh, yeah, you have a sleeping disorder. And the only way that you can get rid of this sleeping disorder if you lose weight. One is I got retested, I don’t have sleep apnea. But, you know, that’s the way that we kind of people are engaged by the medical professionals. So I can see why even some people who even don’t want the quest for thinness are saying I don’t want to die. And I think that we can’t criticize people for wanting to lose weight individually. Because we have not created the alternative system that we dream of. I do not know, I’m not a medical professional, right. I do not know what to tell someone who said, Okay, I have this chronic illness. My doctor said, I need to lose weight in order to get rid of this chronic illness. I don’t feel comfortable as a body image coach to say, don’t lose that weight. You know, I think we have to make room we have to make grace for real life experiences that people are having for the fact that we haven’t built this beautiful world that we want to build where people’s weight isn’t a qualifier for their ability to thrive. We haven’t gotten there yet.

Summer:
Yeah, that is so empowering. Right, because it’s like, well, if you’re saying, okay, choose this other path, but where’s that other path? Putting that person and really thinking about that other person’s situation? Like, I think it’s really easy. I’ll speak for myself. It’s like someone with size privilege for me to be like, yeah, no, you don’t need to die. You don’t need to lose weight. But there’s nothing on the line for me to like, for me to stop dieting, there’s no, like, my experience with the health care practitioner doesn’t change, you know, I can still go to stores and put on clothes and you know, whatever store I want to go to. And that’s not the case for everyone. And I think that leads to the second point of our conversation, which is like, how do intersectionality and bias play a role in our conversations around this? And like, what are your thoughts on when a provider holds more privilege than their client? Like? How do you think they should be handling those conversations, if they have a client that wants to lose weight?

Amapoundcake:
Well, I think one, they shouldn’t avoid the elephant in the room that they are, the person would fit the most privilege in the conversation. One, there’s a power dynamic with being a practitioner in the first place, right? People come to see you the expert, too. I think that there’s all different types of power dynamics class race, in our bias workshop, we talk about how having access to your dominant language and speaking the dominant language in your home and growing up with it’s also a power dynamic. So I think that practitioners should own that dynamic, and also allow the client to help curate their plan, you know, their life, their life, plan, their goals, what they have for themselves. And you may have to still work with a client who wants to lose weight, who is fat and said, I want to lose weight. And I believe that that does not mean that once they get to a weight loss goal, that they still won’t have some body image issues. And so what as any of your body, whether you gain weight, or lose weight, you as a practitioner, have to help them navigate that. And so when I say that you’re the expert, I know I’m the same person tells you guys that you’re the student, but you know, they’re coming there for advice for you. And I have to say it in this way. Because I’ve found that sometimes people are carrying shame when they are in the position of power, like fear of saying the wrong thing. Or I always, you know, say this to like white people, like, I know, you were white therapists before I clicked on this, like, I knew you were white. And so if I didn’t think that you didn’t have a skill, I wouldn’t be there. And I can say the same thing for a thin black woman, right? Or a cisgender, male, whatever the dynamic is, I’m coming to you because I believe that you can help me, so help me and don’t get caught up in your privilege, because that is what racism looks like. transphobia looks like no ableism looks like you’re hindering my ability to thrive because you’re stuck on your privilege. And that in itself is harmful. Yeah.

Summer:
So when you say stuck on your privilege, like how does that look for people who are listening just to get a little bit more specific? Oh,

Amapoundcake:
I could give a clear example. Like earlier this year, we’ll probably a couple of months ago, I had a white therapist, and there was a shooting in Jacksonville, Florida, where I went to college, which is an hour and a half away from my home. And a white man went inside of the Dollar Tree or the Family Dollar and killed three black people, three black people who are in the same age ranges mean, and so it could have been me, right? Like it just could have been. And I kept trying to talk about it. And she kept saying How was work? You know, she was avoidant. And that is a behavior that I find that people in privilege, they avoided. They’re scared to ask a question to, they’re afraid that they’re going to be offensive. But it’s it’s even more offensive, that you are accepting clients who look like me and you’re uncomfortable with talking about race. At this point, you should say this is my expertise for people I probably can’t even help you. And that is the like my life. I cannot accept right blackness from anything I do in my life. And a lot of other clients like, you know, I go to trans workshops to hear about trans people’s experience and what their needs are. And I learned the moment you avoid that this person is trans, you already diminish their whole entire life experience. And you’re not going to be able to help them until you really take the time to understand that and be brave enough to ask the questions. Be bold enough to say I know what I’m doing. I’m not all knowing, but I know enough to say hey, I may not have all the answers, but if you trust me enough, I will help us get there. And that’s okay, that opens the door.

Summer:
Yeah, something I’ve been thinking a lot about. And thank you for sharing that and thank you for sharing your personal story. Something I’ve been thinking a lot bout is is how coaching in general can be a really good facilitator of those conversations because you’re not giving advice, you’re asking questions to understand the person’s worldview, to understand their experience and to, to be able to then honor that and hold space for whatever is there for them. And I think that that’s where I see coaching being like a really useful tool in the facilitation of conversations when there is a different power dynamic, or there are different, you know, identities between the provider and the client. Because it’s when you go into this mode of like, I feel like I have to give advice, that things get tricky, because that’s where you can run into a situation where you’re perhaps suggesting something that isn’t going to land, because you’re coming at it from a place that you’re maybe saying it in a way that you’re not acknowledging your privilege, or you’re not even seeing how privilege plays into it.

Amapoundcake:
And you Thank you. So I’m using the example of my therapist, what you brought up something like, you’re asking questions, you know, my therapist could have talked to me about self care, she could have asked me questions about how does it feel, you know, like, just gently, like, how does it feel and be honest and say, I could never imagine, you know, after I say, like, I don’t ask you that, because I’m trying to put myself in your shoes just genuinely say, like, I want to give you this space, to say, your real feelings without holding back. And even if the thing that you know that your client is saying is going to offend you, in that moment, it’s not their job to process your feelings. For example, I have had several therapists, where I’ve had to the power dynamic where I’ve had to explain to them fat phobia, and I’m spending my entire session explaining fat phobia. They’re keep asking me questions. So can you tell me more about like, fat phobia? You know? No, that’s not what needs to happen. You need to ask me, How does it make me feel? When is the first time I’ve experienced that? Do I have safe spaces? Where I feel that when those things don’t happen, where I’m not experiencing those things? How can I curate that type of environment, when it comes to police shootings, or violent crimes against black and brown people or, you know, or women, sometimes, when it thinks in the mainstream media, there is no real safe space, we might have to talk to your client about shutting down social media, you know, there’s there’s different taxes that we talk about an hour course, that helped with power dynamics, that’s what’s so good about this thing to summer, like, our program is people get to roleplay.

Summer:
And we want people to be you go to experts on body image. And I think that having these skills and having this knowledge will help you confidently be able to say that, and I think that it’s it’s not just about like how we are in a session with a client too. It’s about how we are positioning ourselves outwardly to so like, the way your social media looks, the way your website looks, and all of that stuff. And I feel like we sort of went on a bit of a tangent there. But I feel like it was also it’s an important part of the conversation. Because I think that if you want people to come to you, and to be able to trust you, you can’t just do it on the basis of like, well, I took this course. So therefore you can trust me, it’s like, you actually have to sort of be, you know, really invested in body liberation, and show that through your commitment, whether that be like having seating that’s going to be accommodating to fat people having you know, things on your website that have where you’re talking about, like who your teachers were, or about these issues, and so on and so forth. So it’s not just about like, the conversation in the room. It’s also about your commitment to ally ship, as well. And I’m not saying I’m perfect. I never say that. Please don’t come and scrutinize me. I know. So what are some steps that people can take? Like you mentioned one thing about like getting clear on goals, like if you’re working with a client who still wants to lose weight, or if you are someone who still wants to lose weight? What do you think like a good places to start around that?

Amapoundcake:
Well, one is, like you said, I set the goals, but two is like, how do they want you to support them? And because you have to be clear, right? Like, if you’re someone to say like, Hey, look, I’m not going to support your weight loss journey. And you have to make that clear from the beginning with them. So they know like, I’m not here, they’re not gonna support me in my weight loss journey. They are going to support me on my overall body image and the way that I see myself and they have that clear conversation. And I think the other thing to do is I always tell people to go through that social Do what is on that social media? Who are you following? What are you clicking? Find things that really make them help them find things that really make them feel good about their body that doesn’t constantly make them question their body. Another thing is like asking them like, what kind of checking questions would you like? Like this? Is you helping them build their session with you their conversation with you? And I think those are some like real quick and easy ways to start.

Summer:
Yeah, I love that, I think, yeah, first and foremost, like you said, Get clear on their goals, because let’s say you’re a personal trainer, they’re coming to you. And maybe they actually just want to improve their level of fitness. But they’ve tied that up with weight loss. And so you’re in a great position to be able to give them some good guidance around that and help them focus on improving their fitness and taking weight out of that conversation. And maybe even helping them see how weight loss efforts, take them away from some of the goals they want. Because I think sometimes if someone’s goal is, you know, I want to be more confident, then oftentimes, you can help them see through coaching, that actually engaging in, you know, these weight loss behaviors, they don’t actually really make you feel more confident a lot of the time because we feel like a failure, and you feel like, you know, there’s something inherently wrong with you and your body. And so that’s where again, like I think coaching can really come into play, not necessarily with a goal of changing their mind, but of helping them expand, and maybe think about things that they haven’t previously considered. And then the last thing that I’ll say is that I think you alluded to, to is like looking at where we can add things in. So I know you mentioned like changing social media, and like you always talk about self care, like starting with that, like, where can you add in self care? Where can you add in self compassion? So what are some of the changes that you can do that have nothing to do with weight loss, that are still going to help that person build more compassion, more resilience, and a greater sense of self worth? Regardless of like, what happens to their body in the process? Do we have anything else we want to say about how to help clients if they still want to lose weight or people if they’re still battling that?

Amapoundcake:
No, I guess only thing I would say is like, the empathy piece, right? Like, there’s been moments as even me being a coach, where I’ve even myself, like, should I lose weight, I’m experiencing these pressures from my doctor. Even with being a model like, even though there’s room for plus size model, there are particular types of plus size models, flat tummy size, 16, big brands, big butts, like there’s pressures. So as all of us are still experiencing these pressures, and understanding that sometimes people cling to what they know, and what they’ve seen in quotations work for other people. And so we need to extend grace, as we tell people to extend grace themselves, we also have to give grace because to treat people as like, you need to control them, and tell them what to do is also white supremacy. And we’re trying to move away from that. And that’s all I wanted to say.

Summer:
Thank you for that. Let’s talk about our course. So we’re really excited about a new offering that we have, we have our body image coach certification program. But we’ve heard that there is a need for something that is maybe less intense, that still gives you the foundations to be able to incorporate body image coaching into your practice. And so we’re really excited to be launching our body image coaching foundations course, which is a self study program for providers who are looking to upgrade their skills to support clients with body image. So this is for people who maybe don’t want to do a certification, but they still want these tools, they still want the skills, and they’re looking for something that’s more like DIY, like a self study program versus something that is something that you’re going to engage in with Danny and I specifically. And so we think this course is really great for people who have an existing practice. So if you’re a therapist, if you’re a dietitian, you’ve got like a pretty solid practice. But you really want to incorporate some more body image work into that with your clients, then our Foundations program is going to a new offering that we have and then we have our certification course and this is an advanced course, that in addition to the Foundation’s course, you also get live sessions with us, as well as a lot of bonus tutorials from different experts on different topics related to body image. And that’s really for providers who are looking to start or grow their business as a certified body image coach. So with that, you also get the listing on our directory. You can call yourself a certified body image coach. We have integration classes, where we’ll be doing case studies. We’ll be doing demonstrate durations, there’s tests and a final case study in order to actually become certified. And then with that, you get that listing on our directory and a certificate and you can have the badge on your website, and people will be able to find you for that purpose. Have I missed anything there?

Amapoundcake:
Everything sounds good to me, Summer.

Summer:
okay, well, if you want to learn more about our programs, go to body image Coach certification.com. And you can also get on our email list for providers. Right now you can go to summer innanen.com, forward slash roadmap to get that. And we will be sending out more details when this goes live in January. If you have any questions, feel free to reach out to us. We are super excited about this. And if you have any other questions on what you learned in today’s podcast, feel free to reach out to us as well. Anything else you want to say before we wrap it up here? Danny? Where can people find you? Because they’re not following you?

Amapoundcake:
Oh, yes. Amapoundcake.com. Amapoundcake on all social media platforms.

Summer:
Amazing. Thank you so much for being here today. As always, it’s a pleasure having these conversations with you. And thank you to all the listeners here today. I feel like I got some really good sound bites from that episode. I hope you enjoyed listening to it. You could find the links mentioned at summer innanen.com forward slash 2880. My gosh, I hope I feel better soon. I hope that you’re well. Wherever you are listening to this. I’m jealous of anyone that can like actually rest when they’re sick when you have a child that just never happens. Anyways, thank you so much for listening today. Talk to you next time rock on.

I’m Summer Innanen. And I want to thank you for listening today. You can follow me on Instagram and Facebook at summer Innanen. And if you haven’t yet, go to Apple podcasts search eat the rules and subscribe rate and review this show. I would be so grateful. Until next time, rock on.